November 2020 Chat Thread

[Bean]

I know it was all the way back in October, and this is the November thread, but how was Halloween in the US? Not much happened here, although we did carve pumpkins (second time lucky as I'd ordered two carving pumpkins in my online shop and they substituted them with butternut squash? Rubbish for carving but they did make nice soup!).







It's Bonfire Night this week and usually there are loads of organised bonfires and firework displays, but we've had strict limits on how many people can meet for some time, and are now heading back into lockdown, so that's all off. From the sounds of it, lots of people have bought them to use at home instead - hope the birds are getting some peace!

Shades, I'm interested to know what the current covid situation is over your way? 

[3piggles]

Halloween seems to have gone okay. Peanut attended the birthday party and did Trick or Treat in her cool dinosaur costume. I haven't asked if she got much candy. Some towns had Trick or Treat, some didn't. I figure the kids from the towns that didn't have it, went to the towns that did. For some, hours were shorter than normal, but most did the same hours they've always done. I noticed in pictures daughter posted of Peanut and friends Trick or Treating, no one was wearing a mask I guess it will take a week or two to know if COVID spread through Trick or Treat. I hope not.

There were a lot of suggestions such as not letting the kids take candy from the bowl, but doling it out. That kept all those grubby little paws out of the candy bowl, and reduced contact. Another was to leave the bowl outside, and just supervise through an open door, so the big kids didn't just take the whole bowl. I think it was important for the kids to be able to dress up in costumes and have some fun, but time will tell if the fallout was worth it.

I'm working with the Pro setting on my phone camera. I used that setting to get the picture of the corn stalks around the front yard light. This is a picture of the snow flurries this morning. Yes, that's a squirrel at the seed block under the feeders. He kept eating while I took pictures 🤗

[Bean]

I can see something grey, but it could be a pigeon!

It sounds like things are running a lot more normally over there. I think both the grouping of people in addition to contact points were both seen as problematic here. Mind you, looking at footage from the Trump rallies, it doesn't even seem like there's a pandemic.

I'm rooting for your country to make the sane choice today. The alternative doesn't bear thinking about...

[3piggles]

I'm rooting for us to make a sane choice, too. As I said, I told hubby not to tell me anything, not to even mention the election tomorrow morning, if Biden doesn't win. It will be another day in his reign of terror, so nothing to celebrate, and I certainly don't want to get as depressed as I did four years ago. Granted, four years ago, I didn't think the indecency in this country could run as low as to elect a monster, and was sure, especially with ALL the analysts saying so, that Hilary Clinton would win. It was a huge and horrible blow to learn he had one, and it's been a horrible 4 years. If it's going to be 8 years, I don't even want to mark the election as having existed. Less said the better.

With the photos, I'm still trying to find a setting that does action, as falling snow is action. I think, if I could figure out how to do that, I could get some great falling snow shots. I have a Samsung Note8 phone, and it has one of the best cameras on the market, it just doesn't have one of the best users Got to up my game

That grey blob by the seed block is a squirrel. They tend to bunch up when they eat, probably so nothing sticks out that a predator could grab. We have a Flicker, and he's beautiful. Little Red, the little red squirrel, and Chip the chipmunk are back. They were out helping hubby build a deck, yesterday It's so funny to watch them. No fear of us, at all. They know us, now.

Interestingly, the seed block is for the squirrels, who still go to the suet/seed cake feeders, which are for the woodpeckers. So I regularly go outside and tell the squirrels to get off the feeders, which they do, but the squirrels at the seed block stay there, and continue eating. They seem to know that's okay. I think they're very intelligent, and learn very quickly.

[bazookagoof]

Nov 3, 2020 8:28:17 GMT Bean said:

It sounds like things are running a lot more normally over there. I think both the grouping of people in addition to contact points were both seen as problematic here. Mind you, looking at footage from the Trump rallies, it doesn't even seem like there's a pandemic.

I'm rooting for your country to make the sane choice today. The alternative doesn't bear thinking about...

Reports have stated that because of tRump's rallies, there have been 30,000 additional infections and at least 700 more deaths. Essentially, it doesn't seem like there's a pandemic until the attendees start to feel sick. (Is there anything dumber than tRump killing off his own supporters?)

On a related note, one of my daughter's friends attended a rally with her parents, who are morons. I forbid her to hang out with the child in question for a few weeks until I'm sure they did not get infected.

(Also, it's 7:15pm over here and there have been no results posted yet, but everybody with a brain is crossing their fingers...)

[Bean]

Looks like it could still go either way, but Trump has already declared victory and said if he doesn't win, it's because of cheating so he'll contest it. The man is insane.

It's horrible when it's so close - you know almost half the country will be bitterly disappointed, which doesn't make for a united country.

My camera phone is pretty basic, but I have two decent cameras, and the DSLR (although bulky) has a sports mode which is great for action as it takes a series of shots really close together so you have more chance of capturing the right moment. I should resume the photo exchange mum and I were doing (school holidays always distract me from doing other stuff!) as it definitely made me more analytical about the pictures I was taking in ways that will hopefully help me improve.

[3piggles]

We have a DSLR, but only hubby knows how to use it. My ADHD makes it hard for me to learn and remember, so being able to have a really good point and click option is good for me. Also, the DSLR is big compared to the phone, so we have to hang that around our necks, which means we don't take it with us very often. I also have trouble getting photos he uploads to my phone, to post on Tapatalk. Not at all sure why.

It's now 4 p.m. on Wednesday, and as far as I know, the count isn't finished for the presidential race. Hubby said one of the news groups said there probably wouldn't be a result to post until tomorrow, so the insanity continues. At least the endless Vote For Me adds have finally stopped. As freaking important as they were yesterday, they are totally obsolete today. Ah, the difference a day makes! So the instructions hold. No telling me if HE wins. I'll just go on as if nothing happened, because nothing will have changed

[bazookagoof]

I smile at how opposite I am with cameras- I dislike using my phone's camera unless I have no other option- I prefer my DLSR, and I carry it in my satchel whenever I can. The images I get from my phone never please me, and they're also low resolution compared to what I get out of my regular camera. I also love being able to switch lenses and add the occasional attachment.

But all that is just the shutterbug in me. 

[Bean]

I love the photos from my DSLR but just don't end up carrying it around because of its size (and can only use it in daylight now as the flash has gone on it - it costs a bomb to repair and I've not got on well with using an external flash). The compact takes really nice pictures, and I end up using that more because I can just stick it in my pocket. I really just use my phone as back up. I'd love to understand all the settings on my cameras better than I do, but haven't managed to devote the necessary time to it yet.

[3piggles]

That's the problem with our DSLR. It's an old model, big, bulky, and we have to remember to take it on our hourly walks, which is just one more thing to lug around with us on the off-hand chance we meat up with the foxes, groundhogs, etc. It also seems as if the animals never wait around long enough for us to get the shot set up and taken. Hubby has several pics of fox butts disappearing over the mound of sand, etc. It's a camera better suited to being set up someplace, with someone there to take pictures when a good subjects enters the frame. We used it back in the early 90s to get telephoto shots of NASCAR drivers in the pits. The telephoto lens was so heavy, hubby had to rest it on my shoulder, so we'd be in the tightly packed stands trying to rearrange ourselves to get a good picture. It got to be way too much trouble. We're no longer in the market for a modern, smaller DSLR. Way too much money for us retired folks

Hubby knows how to use the DSLR, but has no concept of setting up a photo, so while his photos are clear, the subject is usually not a major part of the whole picture, and just gets lost. I've been working with him on that, but I don't think he can see the difference between the pictures. He admits the subject is bigger and closer in some, but I don't think he understands that was the point to the picture.

Found some bear prints in the dirt on the front lawn. Proof the big beastie was here.

[Bean]

Oooh yes, you've certainly had a visitor!

My goodness, what a racket here last night with everyone setting off fireworks at home to compensate for the lack or organised displays and having to stay home. It just didn't let up all night, coming from all different directions. Goodness knows where the wildlife went to escape. You can still smell it in the air this morning. I really hope this isn't people's new way of cheering themselves up in our second lockdown.

[amber89]

Bean, with the risk of sounding ignorant...why firework in November?

[3piggles]

Aren't there any noise ordinances, not that anyone does anything about the ordinances in this town. Usually we have to limit noise by 8 p.m., and stop it by 10 p.m. Since we're in a rural area, I doubt the police want to waste their time trying to find the culprits. It's especially hard to crack down on it when there's no other way to celebrate.

Amber, it's Bonfire Night over there. Not sure what it celebrates.

[Bean]

Usually it's no fireworks after 11pm. For Bonfire Night it goes to 12pm and for New Year's Eve, Chinese New Year and Diwali it's 1am. There are always a few people who take the mickey, and not many people do much about - by the time you'd called the police out, they'd probably have finished anyway. Loads more fireworks last night - I think we might be in for a long run of it.

Bonfire Night/ Guy Fawkes Night marks the attempt on the life of King James I back in 1605 - Guy Fawkes was part of a plot to blow up the House of Lords by filling the basement with explosives. It failed and for some reason we decided to make a celebration of his failure by having bonfires, onto which we'd put effigies of Guy Fawkes. Fireworks were a later addition.

They do teach the history of it in schools, but by and large, it's just a good excuse for a party at a time of year when things are getting dark, cold and gloomy. When I was growing up, people would still make guys (effigies) to put on the fire by stuffing old clothes with straw, but I've not seen this in years. The effigies would often be displayed on the days leading up Bonfire Night with people shouting 'Penny for the guy!' at passers-by to raise money to pay for the fireworks.

It caused religious conflict in its early days too, as the country was largely Protestant and Guy Fawkes was Catholic - there was much more of a religious tone to the initial celebrations. And the whole 'burn the terrorist' sentiment might not seem helpful these days either?! But like I say, nowadays people really don't care about all that!

[3piggles]

So how long before the Guy Fawkes Rights groups start protesting against Bonfire/Guy Fawkes Night as celebrating the death of a patriot who was trying to do the right thing by all the lesser classes? We have Native Americans and many others protesting Columbus Day celebrations, and I'm with them on that. Nothing good happened to the Native Americans when the Europeans arrived, and we owe it to them to correct a whole lot of white power history in our history books. I figure it's just a matter of time before someone points out what life was life for most people back then, and that Guy Fawkes we just trying to right some wrongs. Not my opinion, just the opinion I figure some people have had all along.

[bazookagoof]

The whole family got their flu shots today! The funny thing was, my arms already ached all over from work yesterday, so I didn't notice any additional pain. The nurse said there may be pain for a day or two in the shoulder, and both my wife & daughter have been complaining all afternoon. Oddly, the shoulder where I got the shot is the only area where I don't feel any pain at all! 

[Bean]

Ha! Maybe that's your answer - all body flu shots each week?!

I'm not sure Bonfire Night will ever spark much protest or controversy - so few people even care why it started or think of it as anything political or religious, it's just a party. It's like Christmas being an accepted winter holiday, even for the many who have no religious leanings. Everyone knows we've always partied around this time of year anyway, it's just been rebranded by a few people who want to feel powerful.

I can imagine that in Northern Ireland, Bonfire Night Celebrations may not go down well with all though, as there's still some animosity between Protestants and Catholics.

I'm really hoping that our countries' histories can be written honestly. I've always thought that we should be honest about our colonial past and the fact that we did well by exploiting others. Things do seem to be starting to change, and a better understanding is emerging of how we acquired our wealth.

For example there are some stately homes which attract many visitors all year round, and recently they've declared that they were built by slaves and the owners made their wealth from exploitation. It's been done well - they can't change history, but are now acknowledging those who were taken from their home countries and forced into slavery, and saying we should know better than to think that is acceptable now.

It seems to have been okay so far (no one trying to damage stuff etc - although separately, a few statues of prominent figures involved in the slave trade have been vandalised) but of course with the year of covid, it's hard to tell how it will affect visitor numbers in the future.

[3piggles]

While I don't consider stately homes to be as In-Your-Face as statues of Confederate generals, and flying rebel confederate flags, I think it's time everything came out in the open. We've had versions of history that suited the teller, not the truth. That needs to end. Yes, remove the Confederate statues and flags, as they are constant reminders of a horrible time in black America, but put those statues and flags where they can be seen and explained, like the holocaust museum of horrible black history. Tell the truth, and let's deal with the repercussions.

That church v chapel mentality came over here, and was in place for a long time. The NINA signs, first No Irish Need Apply, then No Italian Need Apply, meant No Catholic Need Apply. My mother was terribly anti-Catholic, as were the rest of her family. I heard that endlessly, growing up, and believed it. It wasn't until I met some really nice, really intelligent Catholics that I started to question it. We still have people who call Italians EYE-talians, just to make sure the Italians know they're second best. They're not, but they are to those people

I was thinking more of protest because it can be done, which seems to be the reason for so many protests lately.

[Bean]

There was one statue of a slave trader in Liverpool that got thrown into the harbour as a protest. It was rescued and will apparently be put in a museum. There's a National Slavery Museum there and visiting that is a pretty powerful experience.

There's much discussion about whether numerous buildings and streets all over the country named after people who made their fortunes from the slave trade should be renamed. I think in many cases a better approach is to just be transparent about how things came to be named and fully accept our history - it almost feels like we're trying to airbrush it by just getting rid of them now people are noticing more. You can't change the fact that terrible things happened, but we could be better at just telling it truly how it was and paying proper respect to those who did suffer. And if it leads to more conversations and change, that's a positive thing.

It's all certainly made me and many people I know a lot more mindful and reflective about our history, and of the privileges you're automatically afforded for being white in certain countries.

Incidentally, I recently read a dreadful book on racism 'White Fragility: Why It's So Hard To Talk To White People About Race'. Her whole angle was that as white people (of which she is one), we cannot exist outside the system of white supremacy - we are inherently racist (she does make the point that this is not necessarily intentional or even conscious - racism necessarily doesn't mean you're a bad person, just someone who's been shaped by different learnings/ experiences). We can't ever hope not to be racist, we can only strive to be less racially oppressive by trying to be less white, something which she encourages, and which she constantly strives for herself.

The irony of a book about racism slamming an entire race for their skin colour? But if you don't agree, you're being defensive because of your white fragility.

She did make some good points about the social development of racism, and also what feelings the label of racism/ racist can stir up, which leads to defensiveness rather than reflection.  But aside from some interesting thoughts in that discussion, there was a complete lack of balance, and no evidence aside from anecdotes from her seminars on race, where she claims people often get angry (no kidding if she speaks to people anything like she writes!). It's like an angry rant and so judgmental and divisive. 

I've read several other books on race recently (written by black people), and found them to be interesting and enlightening. This one just made me cross! 

[3piggles]

Unfortunately, she's right, though the problem isn't only with white people, but with all people. It's based on our friend/foe, fight/flight instincts that make us seek others similar to us in the most important ways. I posted all this earlier, and Tapatalk deleted it when I added a photo.

Anyway, by first, not recognizing whole groups of people as being acceptably similar to us, and through that lack of acceptance, rellegating all of those people to less than human status, we create a situation that leads to racism, bigotry and sexism.

Slave owners called African slaves buck's and does, as if they were deer those men hunted, and not humans. Black Africans were so different from white Europeans, white Europeans couldn't equate them as human. They were just a commodity.

The protestant British treated the Catholic Irish worse than they treated their livestock. Protestant British had fought Catholic rule, and didn't consider Catholics to be as good as Protestants.

Americans interred endless Japanese Americans, because we were at war with their ancestral country. We were at war with Germany and Italy, too, but didn't inter all the Germans. They looked like we did. The Japanese looked different with their slant eyes. Obviously, someone who looked so different, couldn't be trusted.

Women have had to fight for every right men have, because despite those women being good enough to raise all the men, the very men they raised didn't think they were capable of managing money or voting. Basically, men understood how men thought, but not how women thought, so women weren't as human as the men. They were property, and property doesn't need to vote or control money.

But all races and religions do this. The different Islamic factions kill each other, because those with different beliefs are wrong, and substandard. African tribes have fought each other for thousands of years, often ethnically cleansing those who were substandard, and can't be trusted or trained.

There are scientific reasons for this. Humans have domesticated themselves, some better than others, and some with more to lose than than others. Along with getting along with others, it become more important for the others to be acceptable. Coming once again, to the friend/foe, fight/flight instincts.

History has proven human society is stronger when it's diverse, yet accepting, much less embracing diversity, is instinctively the hardest thing for us to do.